Marketing to Mums - Amazing Strategies to Supercharge Your Marketing

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Marketing to Mums - Amazing Strategies to Supercharge Your Marketing with Katrina McCarter Ep22

Responsible for an annual spend of over $132 billion dollars each year in Australia alone, mums present an enormous opportunity to businesses of all sizes. Today’s special guest, Katrina McCarter from Marketing to Mums, will open your eyes to a whole new way of thinking about mums and how you should be marketing to them for better engagement, stronger relationships and more sales.

In this episode you’ll hear:

  • The biggest mistakes and misconceptions most brands make when marketing to mums
  • Key trends and research-backed data
  • Differences between mums across the globe
  • Amazing tips for businesses wanting to attract more mums

Listen on your favourite podcast platform

Guest: Katrina McCarter, Marketing to Mums

Katrina McCarter is the founder of Marketing to Mums, a marketing and research consultancy based in Melbourne, Australia. Katrina is a marketing strategist, best-selling author, speaker and business advisor, who specialises in helping business owners and brand sell more effectively to the world’s most powerful consumer, Mums. A prolific researcher into mothers’ behaviours, Katrina has published two books: Marketing to Mums in 2016 and The Mother of All Opportunities launched in New York in 2019. An award-winning businesswoman and mother of three, Katrina is a sought after international speaker and regular contributor to business media. In 2020 she was named on Remodista’s Women2Watch list of 100 global leaders in business disruption.

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Transcript

Nicci O'Mara

If you want to attract more mums to your business, then this episode will open your eyes to a whole new way of thinking about mums and how you should be marketing to them for better engagement, stronger relationships and more sales. Responsible for an annual spend of over $132,000,000,000 each year in Australia alone, mums present an enormous opportunity to businesses of all sizes, which is why I've invited on the podcast a special guest, Katrina McCarter, from Marketing to Mums. Stay tuned to hear about the biggest mistakes most brands make when marketing to mums, the misconceptions, key trends, differences between mums across the globe, and some amazing tips for businesses wanting to attract more mums.

Nicci O'Mara

The Simply Standout Marketing Podcast is for you, the small business owner wanting to supercharge your marketing with simple, actionable strategies and inspiration, so you can smash your goals and grow your business. Now it's your turn to discover what actions to take to make your business truly stand out and succeed. Let's get started.

Nicci O'Mara

Today I want to welcome Katrina McCarter. Thank you so much, Katrina, for joining us today.

Katrina McCarter

Thanks, Nicci. I've been really excited about our chat.

Nicci O'Mara

It's wonderful. It's always good to talk to a fellow mum and also a fellow marketer and find out all of the wonderful things that you know. But to start us off, can you tell us a little bit about yourself what it is that you do?

Katrina McCarter

Yeah, absolutely. So I am the founder of a business called Marketing to Mums, which is a marketing and research consultancy, and I'm based out in Melbourne, and I really specialise in helping businesses attract more mothers and their families into their business, so I consider myself a marketing strategist. I'm also an author of a couple of books on marketing to mums and I speak into nationally. I've got a podcast as well called Marketing to Mums, and I'm a really avid researcher. I love learning more about Australian mothers.

Nicci O'Mara

Excellent. Now you said you love the data side of things and you've obviously done a lot of research on marketing to Mums. What are some of the biggest misconceptions and mistakes you see brands make when they are marketing to Mums?

Katrina McCarter

Great question. Well I did my first research study into Australian mums back in 2016 and I really hoped to get, you know, probably 300 or 400 Australian mums to respond, but I was really overwhelmed when we had over 1800 mums respond. And for us, their key message to us was that 63% of Australian mums believe advertisers, brands and businesses don't understand them. And that's when I went, wow, that's incredible.

Katrina McCarter

And when we drilled down into what the mistakes were, what we saw was stereotyping was their number one thing that really irritated mothers. This ideal of mums being at home, mums wanting pink, fluffy slippers and dressing gowns and some chocolates and a cup of tea for Mother's Day. They really, really push back against. They saw it as a major issue, which we obviously know that it is. And they really wanted to see far more diversity and a better reflection of what a modern family now looks like. So that was certainly a big thing. The other one that they said that really stood out was treating mums like they are all the same.

Katrina McCarter

And this is a big one for moms. They feel like they're being treated like one big, homogeneous group. And we all know there are 6.2 million mothers in Australia, and we're all incredibly different. And what they've clearly said to us through our research is that they want to be respected for their different interests. And also we know through that the different generations of mothers as well are very, very different in their communication styles, also their preferred channel. So they feel like by lumping them all as one group, that's a really big mess for businesses.

Nicci O'Mara

I think you're absolutely spot on. When you think about the Mother's Day promotions and things like that, and it is a pink, fluffy slippers and chocolate and cups. And at the end of the day, that's one small part of the market that would enjoy that.

Katrina McCarter

It's absolutely minuscule is certainly what our research tells us. And we check in every couple of years. So at Marketing To Mums, we're doing two research projects a year normally, but we regularly check in around what are the mistakes and they're really, really consistent. Some of the other ones is treating mums like they're stupid- is a massive one for them. In fact, they were really, really vocal about that issue. But other things were like not being real and advertising being too ideal in terms of thinking that mums are aspirational, whereas largely what we see are mums aren't as aspirational as the advertisers think that we are. So this idea of mother who's beautifully dressed in her lovely active wear with a cup of coffee, pushing the Pram and looking a million dollars is just so far removed from the reality of most mothers.

Nicci O'Mara

That is absolutely true because I love the authentic and the real. And so many mothers find that pressure through advertising that comes from businesses. There is that pressure to look the part and to look amazing. And at the end of the day, it's not real, it's not how things work when a lot of us are working. I work full time, have kids, you know, have a husband and have so many other priorities. So it's just never going to happen that we're going to look perfect running down the street.

Katrina McCarter

I'll give you a great example. I worked with a beverage company and I'm really big about the first thing that you need to do is identify your most profitable segment of the market before you do anything. And they said, that's fine Katrina, we know who it is. They're young mothers, they've got a childhood whos preschool aged, they are highly aspirational, they hang out in the right cafes, go to the right bar classes, and their women about town looking fabulous. And I went really.

Katrina McCarter

And they allowed me to do a research study into their customers. And it turned out that they were women over 45 who were definitely not aspirational. They were drinking their particular beverage because we're trying to cut down on their caffeine and they were vastly different from who they imagine they were. And once we altered the marketing strategy to appeal to that over 45 year old woman, we increase their sales by over 500%. It was astronomical. And it's really about making sure that you're communicating correctly to the right segment of mothers.

Nicci O'Mara

And that's incredible, because if you think about it, if you can't connect with your audience, if you're targeting young mums, when really that's not your audience, the marketing message that you give to a young mum is totally different to a 45 plus mum because we have different priorities and different everything. 

Katrina McCarter

Yeah. And what I see, Nicci, is just on the other foot, if you target too broadly and you go for all mums. Which often I'll meet our client for the time, and I'll say, who's your target audience? They'll say all mums. And I'll say, hold on, they're incredibly different, and if you target too broadly, what happens is you don't connect with anyone and you start wondering, why out my sales coming in? Well, they're not coming in because you are targeting too broadly.

Nicci O'Mara

Yes. And that's the same with any audience. The larger the audience you target, the less people you're going to attract because you can't connect with everyone. The difference even between city mums and country mums, I mean, that's different compared to different lifestyles, different cultures, different ages. And there's so many differences. It's just phenomenal.

Katrina McCarter

Yeah. Absolutely. I did some work a few years ago with a brand of play centres and we surveyed their database and half their ventures appealed a millennial mother, and half appealed to a Gen X mother. Now we know that they have different preferences in communications. So we know that millennial mothers are very much committed to, and I'm talking broadly here, enriching the relationship with their child. It's about bonding. And we know that the Gen X mother's favour really being efficient, being time-efficient. They're really after convenience and they're after multitasking more so. And so for those play centres that appeal to the millennial mother, we talked about the importance of play, having fun together, developing your relationship with your child. Whereas the venues that were appealing to a Gen X mother, we spoke about the free coffee, strong WiFi, comfy couches, free magazines, very different communications.

Nicci O'Mara

It really is funny when you're talking about the difference between your gen X and millennials, it is incredible because I'm a Gen X. And you go, yes, that's absolutely true, some of those things. Now look, so many businesses now actually have a global audience. What did your research find are the key differences between mums across the globe?

Katrina McCarter

Really interesting. I'm fascinated by this. So my first, when I set up Marketing to Mums, my first thing was to look at Australian mothers because, lo and behold, there's not much research around about Australian mothers, which I was so surprised by. And so there was a lot of global research, but there wasn't anything specific. So first and foremost, we had to look at Australian mothers. Then I very much turned my attention to the US. I've got a lot of Australian businesses that are looking to move into the US market.

Katrina McCarter

And whilst we're both English speaking, there are some quite significant differences, certainly in terms of when you start your parenting journey. Here in Australia, the average woman normally is around the age of 30, 31. In the States, that's around 26. Now, there's quite a lot of difference in those six years in terms of establishing your career. So we find that Australian women tend to be far more established in their careers than their US counterparts. We also see a real difference in terms of social media use.

Katrina McCarter

In the States it's a very high use of Pinterest, also a very different use of Twitter. So in the US, they'll have Twitter parties, which is for brands to interact with their customers. And that's done a lot within the Mum segment. That's certainly something that we don't see here in Australia. So there are a couple of things in terms of, we've looked at Indian mothers as well, and certainly Indian mother are very strong in Facebook groups and very strong use of WhatsApp. They're very big about their child getting ahead.

Katrina McCarter

And so very much anything education related is going to be viewed very favourably about advancing their child's skills, that is certainly highly, highly prized. But, you know, if we look at French mothers, I spent some time, had the opportunity to travel and speak in Paris. Women there tend to go back to work much faster. And that's actually the same in the States as well. There's only two weeks leave. So we've got women that have two weeks leave a years. And they don't have a lot of paid maternity leave so they're often banking up their annual leave to prepare for having a child.

Katrina McCarter

But many are returning to work and they're still trying to manage breastfeeding. And that has led to a lot of businesses come up, and one of the ones that I'd love to mention is Milk Stork. And Milk Stork is a breast milk shipping company. So if you have to travel for work, you can arrive in Atlanta and you will have a shipping container there waiting for you, a little pack for you to express your milk. It will be in a refrigerated pack and FedX it back to your home so that you can continue your breastfeeding while you're travelling and working.

Katrina McCarter

So it's really, really tough and different kinds of conditions. So there's lots of nuances right around the world that really need to be understood. Don't think that when you are an Australian business moving into the US for etc, that it's just going to be the same, you will definitely need to have a different marketing strategy.

Nicci O'Mara

That's fascinating, I can't believe about the milk stalk side of things. What an amazing, you know, they've obviously seen the issue and come up with a whole new business to addrress it.

Katrina McCarter

She's really interesting. I have interviewed her on the Marketing to Mums podcast just because I loved the innovation and she had twins and was trying to you know, she got really harass carrying a liter of breast milk back through security when she was travelling because she was trying to maintain her milk and not lose her milk and she had it in ice and she got given a really hard time going through security at the airport and she just went, you know, this is just horrendous and women shouldn't have to put up with this. And so she launched this business and where she's found her biggest market is actually in the Fortune 500 companies that now offer it as an employee benefit, encouraging and seem to be supporting women as they come back to work.

Nicci O'Mara

That's fantastic. I do love that concept, but it would be very different way of messaging over here compared to what it would be in the US for sure.

Katrina McCarter

Yeah. Look, she has actually expanded internationally because what she's finding is that a lot of the US female workers are travelling internationally for work. So she has actually started, I think, started offering the service into Europe as well, I believe.

Nicci O'Mara

Well, good on her. And I know that there are a lot of incredibly innovative businesses out there that are coming up from addressing issues. So I think that is brilliant. Now in your latest book, The Mother of All Opportunities, you talk a lot about tech first mothers. What is a tech first mother and what are some of the opportunities they represent to businesses?

Katrina McCarter

Now a great question. Look, tech first Mums is something that I've seen emerge over the course of probably the last five or six years, and I talk a lot about them. They're actually millennials, predominantly, I will say predominantly millennials. But they're looking for a tech first solution to their problem first and foremost. So whenever they've got a problem, the first place they're going to go to is some kind of tech, which is generally their smart phone, to start finding the solutions. For brands and businesses, there's this opportunity now to almost be 24/7 in a way that hasn't been offered in the past.

Katrina McCarter

It allows brands to be far more relevant and part of their lives is really the opportunity. We did a study of the tech first mums back in, I think was an 2018 to 19, and we surveyed just over 650 Australian mums. And what we really found is that, look, our use of the smartphone is really off the charts. 99% of Australian mothers in this millennial age have a smartphone, and it's generally within a metre. It's an arm length away, it's the first thing they're touching in the morning and the last thing that they'll check before they go to sleep.

Katrina McCarter

But what we also find with them is that they are opting for a lot less advertising. So you will see them actually, they're more likely to have ad blockers. They're going to be really big streamers. So you'll find them using Spotify Premium, YouTube red, which has got all the advertising removed. That's important to them. And that makes it difficult for us as businesses and brands to actually develop relationships with them. So that's one of the complexities of them. We do find that they're very information seeking.

Katrina McCarter

So they do like to do their research, which is super important. And their expectations of customer experience, particularly the digital experience, is exceptionally high. So it's really, really important for business owners that are wanting to appeal to the tech first mother, that they have got a really seamless experience across different platforms, it is super super important. And one of the great businesses here in Australia that I think appeals well to this market, to this tech first market, is a business called Parent TV, which is a subscription based membership which allows parents to download video clips of information from different parenting experts to deal with a specific issue, which might be, I don't know, I might be dealing with a tantrum or something like that, but they can go and this platform is actually void of advertising. So it's really, really well pitched to this Tech First Mother segment.

Nicci O'Mara

I actually find, I'm just thinking about last night I was streaming something, but it was a commercial TV app that I was watching, and every time the ad came on, I got so frustrated and I'm not a millennial, but I was so frustrated. And it was interesting because I was annoyed at the ads interrupting me, which isn't a good thing for advertisers, because you don't want people annoyed at you for interrupting their time.

Katrina McCarter

Covid certainly change things. I mean, for all segments, for all generations, really, because we have all experienced lockdowns, no matter where we're located in the world. And with that, we have certainly turned to Netflix in droves and a number of other streaming devices. And we're now very used to having that curated content freely available for us to watch at our convenience when we want it, and without the advertising. So I can understand and I can sympathise and empathise with your frustrations. I think the bigger challenge for Netflix is now keeping up with those in lockdown with having enough content that they haven't watched already.

Nicci O'Mara

Yes, it is, without a doubt. And I find that's why I always say to my clients: email is really important, social media, your email, your website, those side of things are so much more important now than ever before. And the last five years websites have changed and even more so in the last 12-18 months, websites have changed from being purely informational, those that are obviously aren't ecommerce websites. They were purely informational, but now they need to be so more and they need to be innovative. They need to give the information, but also lead people to taking action and to actually building that relationship with them, whereas that wasn't needed five years ago.

Katrina McCarter

understand what's the journey that you want someone to take through your website and how do you lead them through that as well. That's how we need to be thinking as marketers. What's the flow that we want people to go through? I would say the importance of having third party testimonials as well. It has really increased in importance if you're trying to appeal to mothers and not just having a testimonial page, but actually flowing those throughout the website pages.

Nicci O'Mara

Yes. And also, it's so much easier now to get testimonials with all of the amazing technology in terms of you can send someone a link and they can record something on their phone which is a testimonial rather than doing the old written testimonials which people hate doing because they want it all to be perfect. So I have found that a lot easier doing things that way, but I'm surprised at the number of bigger organisations that don't use testimonials or they use testimonials that don't connect with their actual customers.

Nicci O'Mara

And I think that's another important part of we don't want to just look at a product or the benefits of a product. We need to be talking to people about testimonials, about the results and the transformation that they got to deal with the problem that they had.

Katrina McCarter

Yeah. Look, I've got some interesting research around Testimonials. Since 2016, we've been asking Australian mums, what's the number one reason you buy and what has the greatest influence over you're buying? Now, being a mum and marketer, I would have said it's a mum to mum recommendation. Someone telling me verbally, you know, this is a business I need to go and have a look at. It actually is not. The number one thing that will influence a mother based on all our research has been a written testimonial.

Katrina McCarter

And that's shown up multiple times now. So I'm highlighting that testimonials are in incredibly important and particularly given the level of research that mothers do. Women, by comparison to men, have a different buying process. So women are looking for that perfect solution, whereas men are often just looking for a solution. And when you are looking for the perfect solution, you're going to do a hell of a lot more research. And that third party endorsement that is provided by testimonials is instrumental. It is so influential in helping a woman find that perfect solution.

Katrina McCarter

So I say every business who is wanting to appeal to mothers needs to have a testimonial strategy. I know you were talking about that great technology, but one of the things we do with our research projects when we're identifying who that most profitable segment of the mum market is for a business, we're also eliciting a huge volume of testimonials for them that could be used for the next couple of years by the business. And it's not just getting the testimonials, it's actually then amplifying them. And so often you'll see people will turn on recommendations on their Facebook page.

Katrina McCarter

That's not enough. What you actually then need to be doing is taking those taking those testimonials and actually putting them on a graphic, on a branded graphic and make sure that you're sharing them. Sharing one testimonial, a minimum of once a fortnight is certainly what I recommend to my clients, but making sure that they're easily accessed. And I say to my clients, don't put out a marketing material unless it's got a testimonial on there because they are that influential.

Nicci O'Mara

And I totally agree with you. And that's really interesting research that you found because you do think word of mouth will be the driving force. However, it's a start. I would always think it's, you know, that's the instigator to actually go somewhere and have a look and do the research. 

Katrina McCarter

Look, as I said, I would have expected that a mum to mum verbal recommendation would have been in first spot. So it's probably one of the more biggest surprises that I've found through my research and to have it show up each time we do the research. It really does say that written testimonials are important. I will say those mom to mom recommendations come in closely into second spot, but they're not in top spot.

Nicci O'Mara

See, we learn something new. Now, when it comes to marketing to mums, what are some of the key trends that business owners should be aware of?

Katrina McCarter

Yeah, well, straight up. First one, the power of testimonials without question. But other things that I would say is we are really seeing a trend towards convenience and time that mums are valuing them at a much higher regard than they have in the past. So what that means is that mums are prepared to pay more for better convenience or things that are going to save her time. So if that's something that you can offer, have a look at your pricing strategy because it's a really, really important reason that she's buying.

Katrina McCarter

Something else that we've seen come through is that mums are really increasingly wanting to support other female owned businesses. So if you're someone who's listening, who's a female who owns the business and you're trying to attract women and mothers to your business, I would really be leveraging your brand story being that woman behind the business, because mums are really showing that they want to actively support women in business. So that's a big one. Something else we've seen is that audio is really growing in popularity and they love podcasts.

Katrina McCarter

We found in 2019 that more than 40% of Australian mothers are listening to a podcast every month. And I do expect that those numbers will have increased when we do our next check in on that for our research. And lastly, I would say there is a really increasing role that dads and grandmothers play in life right now in terms of caring for children. And certainly if we look at Grandma specifically, Grandma's being relied upon a lot more to do childcare than she has in previous generations because of the high expense of childcare.

Katrina McCarter

And now Grandma is doing some of the shopping. And she's also got an opinion on some of the products or services that the parents should now be transacting with. And so what I'm talking certainly to a lot of bigger brands is, what's your grandma strategy? Because Grandma does have an influence now. And I think that that's important to have a look at. The other thing we're really seeing is a great positive change that dads are wanting to be far more involved in domestic duties and responsibilities.

Katrina McCarter

They want to be a far more visible presence in their children's lives. And with that, they are having a lot more influence on products and services that are selected within that home environment or concerning their children. Mum is still, we're seeing, making that ultimate decision and often doing a lot of that kind of admin work behind the scene that we call that mother load that she carries. But dad is also influencing that as well. So what we're seeing now is the path to purchase is now a little bit more complex then it has been previously. And there are other stakeholders that you need to be considering in your marketing activities.

Nicci O'Mara

Do you think that the dad component is a lot more, they're a lot more involved since Covid and locked down and more involved in the purchasing process since Covid hit?

Katrina McCarter

Great question. I can speak anecdotally rather than research based, we see generationally the younger the dad, the far more involved they are. I think Covid and our life on Zoom has allowed us to be far more human. And I think that there is much greater empathy for the role of being a mother, of wearing many different hats. And I think that there's greater empathy. And I can't comment, as I said, without research as to how more involved that the dads are. But a lot of the reports are saying that they're not. The intentions there, but it's not actually happening at the level that they might like to say.

Nicci O'Mara

Yeah. It'll be interesting to see over the next sort of two, three, four years what the changes will be within marketing and within families as well. The last five years, there's been such huge changes, and I'm sure those changes are just gonna speed up.

Katrina McCarter

I think so. I was really curious when we first went into lock down, I'm in Melbourne. When we first went into the first lock down, we did a big research project to have a look at the impacts of home isolation. And we saw some really interesting trends that have come out of there. And we've published a report that's freely available called ISO Mums. And one of the key findings there, we actually saw self care really come up very strongly. So mums are now recognising that if mum's not coping, if mom goes down sick, it really, really has a major, major impact.

Katrina McCarter

So we saw a lot more mums engage in self care that we hadn't seen before, and they were really starting to reprioritize putting themselves first. So I think, yeah, that is fantastic that we've seen. The other thing we saw out of that, Nicci, was that there's a real sense of wanting to invest in the local community. There's a big drive towards supporting small business and local business. So I think that will be really interesting to watch over coming years as well.

Nicci O'Mara

I think they're all definitely very positive changes, that's for sure. And I know personally how hard the whole self care thing is and it isn't until you sort of all of a sudden fall into a heap to go, oh, okay, I need to change that. Now look, what are some of the top tips for business owners wanting to attract more mums and their families to their business?

Katrina McCarter

Look, first up, I think the most important thing you can do, if you do nothing else, is to understand who your most profitable customer is. What's the most profitable segment of the mum market for your business and brand? And that will often start with doing a research project, often a survey to really understand your core customer. I think that that is, without question, the thing that most businesses overlook and are not willing to invest in. And for me, I see this save enormous amounts of money for brands who do it because it allows them to have a great degree of clarity around where they should be investing their money as well, what channels they should be looking into, what their messaging should be.

Katrina McCarter

So that for me, is the number one thing. The other thing that I would say is Mums really don't want those strong push sales messages. They really, really rejecting those. And it's much more subtle, soft selling, which I often say works really well with story selling, where you're talking about the experience of another customer or someone just like them who has used your servers or your product and talking about their experience. So it's a little bit different from a testimonial as such. It almost feels like there's a storytelling element to it. That works incredibly well in appealing to mothers, and it really can result in some really great sales numbers. Lastly, I think we've talked about it quite a bit today Nicci, is just those power of testimonials, do not underestimate how powerful they are and how influential they are in attracting mothers.

Nicci O'Mara

Look, I think they're all wonderful tips. From a messaging point of view I 100% agree with the whole brand storytelling because it is the one thing that helps people to connect with your brand. You're not trying sell a product. You're selling a solution. You're selling, selling a dream, a transformation people have. If they don't have a problem, they're not coming looking for you. So they want something solved in the way that best suits them. They're not necessarily looking for the cheapest or they need something in particular that connects with them.

Nicci O'Mara

And we all want to be connected with, especially with smaller businesses. We want to actually go, hey, look, I get those people there my type of people. That's my type of business. I love what their values are, what their mission is, and I really get them. So I think that's so important that businesses do change that. So, yes, I totally agree with that one. Yeah.

Katrina McCarter

I mean, I think that I say to clients all the time, your brand story is powerful and influential. Please use it. Certainly, women want to understand your origin stories because, as you said, subconsciously, they're assessing whether you share, whether your business shares the same values that they do. That is what's going on behind the scenes and for you to share your story and show your passion for what it is that you do and why you're different as well. I often say that people like us for our differences, not because we're the same. And our job as marketers within a business is to amplify those differences.

Nicci O'Mara

Absolutely. Because if you can't stand out with your differences, well, you're no different to anyone else. Now, we were talking before about surveying clients and customers. Have you got a favourite survey question or research question that you like asking customers?

Katrina McCarter

Yeah. I find there are lots of people that might leave your business without saying something to you about what was really bothering them or annoying them. And it might be something relatively small that you could easily fix. And I think it's so important to encourage people to have a forum to share something that you could do to improve in your business. So one of the, I only ever ask a couple of open ended questions in a survey, and one of them that I tend to go with is 'what's the one thing that you would change with whatever the business is?' And what we're looking for there is some consistency in some of those that the business can invest in. So I do like to uncover 'where are the improvements that this business can make?'

Nicci O'Mara

Yes. Oh, look, I do that with my clients. What could I improve on? Because otherwise you don't learn the things that annoy them or everything else could have been perfect. But it could have just been one little thing that if you could improve, would make your service or your products so much better.

Katrina McCarter

Yeah. Look, Nicci, I find language is really important with that question as well. So I always ask what's the one thing so that they really hone in on one particular thing, and that's where I'm looking for, is there something that keeps repeating here that a number of people have said that I really need to do something about in this business?

Nicci O'Mara

Yes. Look, we should all be improving all the time anyway. Now look, what's next for you?

Katrina McCarter

I'm thinking about writing another book next year. That's something that's pondering away in my head at the moment. And in the interim, I'm gearing up for season three of my Marketing to Mums podcast as well. So they're probably the two key things that are going around in my brain right now.

Nicci O'Mara

Well, that's very exciting because I know how much work goes into both writting a book and into a podcast.

Katrina McCarter

Yeah. Well, I've had a seven month break from my podcast, so yeah, I completely appreciate the work as well, Nicci that goes into it. You do a great job. When I saw that you release weekly, I was like, wow.

Nicci O'Mara

I have actually just changed to fortnightly because this is a fairly big thing. And also, there has to be a balance between the work of working for clients and making sure I give them the best service I possibly can. But also, I do have a family that do need me after they finish school or when they get concussion or all the other things that kids do. So no it is very good and that's very exciting. So I'll be looking forward to listening and also watching out for your book as well.

Katrina McCarter

Yes. Thank you.

Nicci O'Mara

Now, if our listeners want to connect with you and also to find some of that research that you were talking about, that I that you have on your website for free and to find any of your books, what's the best way for them?

Katrina McCarter

Thanks, Nicci. I would say definitely over at the Marketing to Mums website, which is www.marketingtomums.com.au. I've got two free research reports on there. One is the State of Motherhood in Australia, and the other one is that Iso Mums report, that's really, really, quite extensive. And there's also there you can get in contact with myself and books and the podcast, but I play on LinkedIn a lot, so you can find me under Katrina McCarter over on LinkedIn. I would love to connect with you.

Nicci O'Mara

Fantastic. Look, thank you very much for joining us here today. I'll put all of those links actually in the show notes so people will be able to find those. And look, best of luck with the new podcast series and also with your upcoming books. I'll be excited to see.

Katrina McCarter

Nicci can I say a really big thanks? It's great to get together with another marketer and talk marketing, so I really appreciate the opportunity.

Nicci O'Mara

Now it's been wonderful. And I've learnt, of course, so much of you as well. So thank you very much for coming and sharing all of your information with us.

Katrina McCarter

A real pleasure. Thanks, Nicci.

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